A Talk In the Attic hosted by Kirk Ross “MONTAY LEE is a Victor”

A Talk In The Attic Kirk Ross

Episode Summary

Today’s episode was a blast creating and I hope that you enjoy the collaboration. I had a great time chopping it up with the host of A Talk In The Attic, Kirk Ross. We had an awesome conversation about life, social dynamics with law enforcement and the community & a variety of relevant topics. Next week we will get back to our regularly scheduled programming. In the interim, sit back, relax, and enjoy the conversation. 

“Have a victor mentality rather than a victim mentality”. – Montay Lee 

A Talk In The Attic hosted by Kirk Ross, Ep. 103 MONTAY LEE is a Victor

A Talk in the Attic Hosted by Kirk Ross

Visit & follow ‘A Talk in the Attic’ Hosted by Kirk Ross for laughs, jokes & genuine conversations.

MONTAY LEE is a Victor (A Talk in the Attic) Hosted by Kirk Ross

Kirk sits down with his friend Montay Lee to discuss an array of topics ranging from his role as a probation officer to music and ultimately his new podcasting project Karat Juice. Between talk of the San Antonio Spurs and expensive sandals, the duo tries to solve the massive divide facing our nation. Montay’s positive disposition and worldview make it impossible not to like him, but don’t take our word for it. Music includes Thundercat & Ty Dolla$ign, Anderson.Paak, Kid Cudi, Future, and Drake. Theme by HILTON & Lover Boy. 

A Talk In The Attic Links

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Podcast Transcript:

Montay Lee 0:07

This is a talk in the attic. We’re gonna have a conversation today about me.

And I’m looking forward to it. It’s gonna be a good time. I got so much to say it’s just a little time

Music 0:21
missing this ad is not going on but there ain’t no need to panic. Coming up and join we get Wow get Medic.

Medic. Every week got something new to say be no filter this shit coming straight from the brain

Montay Lee 0:36
to 42 for you were 240 better than I do. Yeah. So like when I was working all the time I was at

to 232 35 but I don’t mind being 240 I’m 65 to 40. So it’s different than Yeah, yeah, so I’m here with Montay Lee, we already have his stats. Six, five to 40 You’re the probably the most physically imposing character I’ve had on the show so far. Awesome. I’m glad to be there. Tell me Tell me a little bit about yourself. So why why?

Kirk Ross 1:06
I’m not gonna say why. You know, everyone’s got a story. Everyone’s got value. But what are we gonna talk about today? Tell us a little bit about you.

Montay Lee 1:13
Well, me I grew up in Grand Rapids, Michigan. Born and raised I was always somebody that was into sports in a having a good time into, you know, being jovial what people good time, Charlie, but you were serious. Are you serious in school, you know, even as a kid and serious in school? No, I’ve always been somebody that’s like, very observant. And I’ve always had a lot of friends. But I wouldn’t say I was the popular kid in school. I was just a kid that you know, everybody knew, you know, and I was in the chess club.

Kirk Ross 1:54
Oh, yeah. In high school, I love chess loves to play.

Montay Lee 1:59
I don’t have anybody to play with. If I did, I would play. I love to cook. I love food. I love to have a good time. I love to dance when there’s some good music on that’s where we that’s where you and I kind of first started running into each other. We always see each other dancing on the club. Yeah, man, just good times good vibes.

Kirk Ross 2:18
You know, life’s too short to be all serious, for sure. But your job is pretty serious. You could say that.

Montay Lee 2:26
Yeah. So I’m a probation officer. So here in the state of Michigan, Grand Rapids. And the way I got into that I actually went to Piper college. So it’s a small Christian college right here. And yeah, yeah, right here in gr. And I went into the Social Work program, and I ended up doing my internship at the court that I’m working at now. But I got into that, just because growing up where I grew up, you know, inner city, Grand Rapids, I seen a lot of things as a young person, I seen a lot of people who didn’t have that much direction. And when I went into the probation department, and I saw the opportunity to help people who pardon my French who looked like me, I seen a lot of, you know, young black people who just kind of needed some guidance. And I was just like, you know, what, I could be that person that could relate to them, for sure. You know, I think the message would be better heard if it’s some from somebody that looks like you. So from that point on, I felt like it suited me well to be in that role as a probation officer. And you’ve been in that for how long now?

Kirk Ross 3:42
Including your internship, your internship started in 2013. So you’ve been you’ve been at it for 7-8 years?

Montay Lee 3:48
You know, probation supervision, and it’s been a good ride, and I enjoy it everyday, like literally, like people talk about their job and what they do. And I really don’t feel like it’s a job, like, you know, I look forward to going to work I look forward to, you know, being somebody that’s going to hopefully, do something and be that person that actually helps somebody in their life in a tough time, because I see people in their worst, and they’re worse at times. Yeah. So in these cases, I mean, your day to day is talking with your what, what is your caseload like? What is the person that’s part of your caseload called? We call them defendants and defendants? So? So they’re typically it’s typically postconviction? Yeah, usually, or most of the time, it’s post conviction. So I do supervisions a lot. So that’s like your supervisor, somebody who’s already been sentenced by the judge, but I also do presets investigations. Oh, that’s when somebody pleads guilty. The judge orders a psi and then I do an investigation, right before they’re sentenced to get, for instance, if it’s a drunk driving case to get their version of what happened.

If they crashed into somebody, you got to reach out to the victim to see if they were hurt. If they were hurt, did they have to pay anything out of pocket due to those injuries? And if so, you got to get all that information, and put it all together in a report of along with supervising the person during all that in between time to see if they can follow directions if they can, you know, comply with the court’s obligations, right, if this person would be appropriate for whatever their recommendation for sentencing would be, whether that’d be jail, that’d be probation, because people don’t realize that probation is an alternative to jail. Right. So during that whole time, I’m like monitoring. And eventually, I’ll put together a report, a pre sentence report that the judge will review. So the judge can make a more informed right judgment when it comes to sentence. So does that include a sentencing recommendation from you duration? Usually? Yes, usually, it’s a recommendation. And that’s exactly what it is, it’s a recommendation, the judge is going to make the final call, but they’re basically employing us at that time to do that work beforehand. So they’re not making a judgment blindly, right and want to know more about the person before they make that decision that could affect that they don’t have the time to do the interviews themselves. And that’s what we’re there for to investigate. So then you work pretty closely with the prosecution team, then like on a day to day basis, are you separate from them? Or how does that How do they keep those in silos? You know, we’re separate from them. But we do have conversations, you know, we’ll ask them questions about like the charge and write any more information. But it’s completely different sides of the like, once it gets to us, they’ve already pled guilty to the charge or whatever. And then it’s on us to pretty much work for the judge. So they have the information so we can move forward with the case. That’s interesting. So do you ever see

Kirk Ross 6:56
whether anything that you don’t want to talk about? Just say you want to decline? That’s cool, you know?

Montay Lee 7:00
Oh, yeah, of course.

Kirk Ross 7:02
So do you ever see like certain like, not even certain judges, but does it ever happen where something is so lopsided? Like your recommendation is here, and the sentence is over here? And does it ever make you wonder, like, what’s going on there?

Montay Lee 7:13
That does happen from time to time. But it, it rarely does. Because usually, during the pre sentence investigation process, when I’m talking to the person, when a probation officer is talking to the person, we also do a criminal background check, to check their entire criminal history, if it’s somebody that has no prior offenses, no prior convictions, they’re going to get a lighter sentence, more likely than not no jail, probation, right. But if a person has four or five felonies, multiple violent convictions, multiple drunk driving convictions, that person is more likely not going to get, you know, jail, or something that’s more stiff because of that history. So it’s not like it’s not cut and dry. It’s not cookie cutter. It’s, it’s based on all of those different factors. And that kind of allows you to have a template like a baseline to go from like, Hey, this is consistent with somebody that has this, this and this. So I try to be fair with my recommendations in that. Yeah, in that way, taking all of those things into account. Also, does the person have any remorse, anything what they’ve done, I take that into effect, that’s part and part of the interviewing process, exactly. Seeing if the person is actually taking ownership for what they did, of course, or are not going to continue that behavior and are willing to go to counseling, treatment, things like that, rather than saying, just blowing, blowing it off, you blow it off, that’s going to be taken into account. Yeah, that means you haven’t really learned exactly.

Kirk Ross 8:44
So there is some discretion on your side of it, though, too.

Montay Lee 8:46
Oh, yeah, it’s a lot of discretion. One thing I like a lot about the role, we get discretion, we have great supervisors who allow us to x, you know, I have great supervisors will last me to ask them questions, if it’s something that I’m not sure about. But for the most part, I’m working, you know, they trust me to do what I’m going to do. And I take all of those things into account, I try to be as fair as possible. Of course, like, if I see anybody that I’ve had, or something like that, on probation, or whatever, I hope that when they see me or somebody asks how I treated them, I treated them fairly and with respect, that’s what I’ve always tried to do.

Kirk Ross 9:24
And you probably get good results from your, from your defendants for that reason.

Montay Lee 9:27
For the most part, yeah, I feel like with anybody in any, you know, walk a life or whatever. If you treat somebody with respect, it’s usually mirrored and you get that same thing back. And if I don’t like if I’m talking to somebody, and then I’m talking to them just normally in a respectful tone and stuff, and then they lash back at me. It’s not my first thing to go back at them with that because usually that just means that there’s something else of course, you’re lieing there, that’s usually and it’s just like, it’s my job to be a like, I felt like a lot of my job, that’s what I’m going to deescalate. And I’m trying to get to what’s going on underneath that anger, that fear and stuff like that. I do have a social work, man, that’s like a social worker. Yeah, that’s what a lot of it is. So that’s why I like the role of probation officer. Because, yes, I do investigations. But I’m also a case manager, right? Because I supervise people too. So it’s like the best of both worlds. And that background of social work helps a lot. Because you, you deal with a lot of people who, you get lied to a lot, you know, you learn how to read those things. But when you really peel back the onion, and the layers behind all this, it’s it’s a lot of hurt. Of course, we’ve been in really, you know, difficult, you know, situations in their life. So I’m trying to guide them through that too.

Like, yeah, man. That’s, that’s really cool. That’s, that’s genuine. Jessica and I first met you a couple years back, and we were always so we had a similar conversation about why you’re in. So that was always something that was always one of the reasons why I want to get on here. Because I think in light of all the police the conversation about policing in America and the racial part, like who better to talk to you than someone that’s really not a cop?


Kirk Ross 11:06
But you’re working with them? Yeah. You’re black, obviously. But you’re also not, you’re also you have a compassion for the defendants as well.

Montay Lee 11:15
Yeah. Right.

Kirk Ross 11:15
Because you really are the middle person? And do you? I mean, what is your reaction to all of that stuff that’s going you don’t I mean, like, how do you, you are in a unique position, right, or a unique perspective for it?

Montay Lee 11:27
Yeah, it’s a unique perspective, because I’m not a cop. But I read a lot of the reports and things and I can see, I see both sides of it, or I see a lot of the things that have gone on, you know, it’s interesting to have that perspective. Okay.

And be my, me myself, I’ve had situations when I was in college, I had a situation where I was driving to a buddy’s house. After going to the mall. I went to the mall, and I got like a Surf City squeeze like a smoothie. It’s like, it’s like the most innocent shit ever. Yeah, I got a smoothie or whatever. And then I was driving to my buddies to go like, play video games in Holland or whatever. And I got stopped by a cop, on my way, you know, to his house, and the cop stopped me.

Kirk Ross 12:14
For what reason?

Montay Lee 12:15
I don’t know, it was daylight. And then he said it was for a tail light that had a plate that was no, the the license plate said that the light was out, but it was daylight. Stop me, you know, the whole shindig or whatever said he smelled something on my breath. And I was like, Surf City squeeze. I was like, what? And then and then he breathalyze me, actually breathalyze me it was all zeros. Yeah, because it was just a smoothie. But like, that’s one of the situations that I had in my life where I’ve experienced that as a black person. And I can understand and relate to somebody who gets stopped, you know?

Kirk Ross 12:54
More often. Yeah, somebody that doesn’t look like me. It’s unconstitutional to pull someone over for no reason and give them a breathalyzer. Yeah, that’s the reality of it. Right?

Montay Lee 13:02
We also got to realize and notice that people do have preconceived notions, preconceived biases.

Kirk Ross 13:10
It’s just, it’s a natural thing.

Montay Lee 13:12
Yeah, you know, but I think when we can get past the white versus black thing, the you versus them thing, and we can get more to just understanding where the other person is that a lot of the cops who are out there and protecting and serving doing the right thing, a lot of them just can’t relate to somebody that looks like me, because you live in a neighborhood where you, you’ve never really been around people who look at me, like me, so how can you, you know, feel as comfortable? Yeah, I believe that there’s some growth there that can happen on both sides to help quell some of those tensions. And anytime I walk past the officer, I always say, Thank you for your service. Yeah, no matter what, because that’s like, that’s not an easy job. No, a lot of the times if you’re a cop, you’re going into a situation on somebody’s worst day

with mental illness and substance abuse and all that, you know, calls about somebody’s got a gun here or there right after a while. It all it takes your toll on you, you would think and I bet you most of the cops that are riding around they are suffer from some kind of like PTSD for sure. And I think there’s been studies have shown that I don’t have the source right off the bat. Right. But there is something going on in regards to that. That

I think needs to be delved into more but overall, I’m kind of going on a tangent.

Kirk Ross 14:37
No, yeah, no, I like I like what you’re saying.

Montay Lee 14:39
Overall. I do believe that there has been some progress made just by the intense media coverage that has gone through with the whole black lives matter. Yeah. Lifestyle. Yes. I’m not gonna say movement.

Kirk Ross 14:56

Montay Lee 14:57
I’m not gonna say movement because that’s something that comes and go. I can’t Change, I can’t stop being black.

Kirk Ross 15:01

Montay Lee 15:02
I’m going to be black when I leave here, it’s always going to be there. And I feel like if we can get to a place as a culture of empathy, of realizing, this is my plight, this is what I deal with, as a black man move into the world.

Just because as a black person, I want to see, equal treatment doesn’t mean it diminishes any other person’s treatment. Because at the end of the day, if you’re going to treat

a fellow man with dignity and respect, it’s only going to help everybody at the end of the day, right, you know, without getting too political, like that’s kind of my stance on the whole thing. It’s pretty, there’s empathy on both sides for the the situations that people deal with, because I couldn’t imagine being a white cop, going and policing a black neighborhood. Everybody’s fearful, fearful of you, for the most part scared because they’ve experienced some kind of, you know, some bad thing or something. Bad Apple, not the majority, right? Literally, like 96% 97% of the cops who are out there, I believe, are doing the right thing doing their job, but a couple of bad actors can really, you know, taint your image, right. So I don’t want to feel like I’m bashing the police.

Kirk Ross 16:18
No, of course, of course.

Montay Lee 16:19
Yeah. But I think if the community overall realizes that is a tough job, and commend officers who are doing the right thing, you know, if one of their fellow officers is treating somebody poorly, actually stepping in and not getting condemned, because I’ve seen these stories and heard these stories about there was a cop who she did that she was in New York, I don’t got her name right now. But she stepped in and helped.

Like she, like somebody was getting abused, like a black person was getting abused by one of her.

Oh, by another cop?

Kirk Ross 16:53
Her white partner who had multiple complaints.

Yeah, he’s a bad one that..

Montay Lee 16:58
Yeah, of like, you know, roughing people up, she stepped in. And then she got reprimanded for it. And after litigation and stuff going through with the union and everything, the police unions are so powerful, she ended up

getting fired. And it was like, a couple of years before she got her pension. And like, they get their pension at like 25. She was at like, 21. And she still hasn’t got her pension to this day. I don’t have the name right off the bat. But things like that, like, That can’t happen. No, right. Yeah. Somebody does like the right thing. And stance. Yeah, in line. And, you know, right. Next, somebody who is abusing somebody, we got to protect the officers who are doing the right things.

Kirk Ross 17:38
I mean, I feel like I feel like as someone that has really no real standing here as a non competent white guy, you know, like, I feel like on the on the cop side, there’s kind of this code of silence, right?

Montay Lee 17:48
And a lot of cases, not cop bashing. I agree that most people are good. Now in some of those big cities, there have been wild corruption going on in times. But yeah, I don’t feel like that’s the case here. Doesn’t feel like that. I’ve had all great interactions for the most, including professionally, right? Oh, yeah, definitely. And so but I feel like there’s still that code of silence kind of like there is a lot of you don’t tell why, because someone does, and you don’t get your pension now. So you kind of dependent on the other side, on the community side. There’s also kind of this staunch position of anti all cops, you know, in some in some particular cases. And, again, that’s not black and white. I don’t mean racially, but a black and white, binary way to look at things. You can’t always be silent. You can’t always be against the cops, you have to we have to look at these things

Unknown Speaker 18:29
on a case by case basis. But if it always comes down to empathy and respect, there’s no way we can lose in that with that recipe. Right? Yeah, absolutely. Like, and I feel like, we’ve gotten away from that. As I say, we like the culture like people

Unknown Speaker 18:46
have just, I’m right.

Unknown Speaker 18:50
You’re wrong. Left, right. No, you know, I’m saying, yeah, there’s no real conversation. And eventually, it gets to a point where it’s just like, the truth is not anywhere, you know, to be found, you know, empathy, and the gray area is nowhere to be found. And I always harken back to.

Unknown Speaker 19:09
So many times when you have conversations, or what I’ve seen I don’t even get involved in a lot of the political stuff that happens on like Facebook and all that. Yeah. What you see is people are not listening. People are they see a comment or they see somebody’s viewpoint and they’re automatically got their response. They’re not listening to comprehend, right? They’re not digesting the information. If it doesn’t fit, what their viewpoint is on both sides. It’s automatically this is our response to that, or have you been trying to, I feel like you can have a way better conversation with somebody by having a conversation with somebody who doesn’t agree with exactly what you mean. Like doesn’t have the same viewpoints as you I don’t want to talk to people who have the same viewpoints as me all the time. What’s the fun in that? You guys want to be alone? I want to learn if somebody has a different viewpoint than me. I like to ask, Why do you think that

Unknown Speaker 20:00
that way. Yeah, not even not in a challenging way. So you want to know, I want to know like, oh, because I’ve never experienced that. Okay, so let’s delve deeper into that. I feel like if you listen to comprehend, rather than just quick witted, what’s your response? We can go so much for Yeah. Doing? Yeah, of course. It’s like, you see that all over the place, even like in day to day conversations, actual physical conversations. It’s it started on Facebook, right? Because when you’re behind the anonymity of the internet, even though your name is out there on it, a lot of times, you’re still protected by all the space and like, you’re not gonna see the person’s face that you’re hurting. Yeah. You know, you know, it’s hard to hurt someone’s feelings to their face. Yeah, a lot harder than on a keyboard. And it’s a lot of people that got the Meek Mill Twitter fingers, they really spicy and stuff when it’s, you know, they behind the egg on Twitter. But if it’s you half of those things that you’re saying you would never say that to somebody in real life? Of course not. But now I feel like that is spilling over. We’re now even there’s less civility and face to face interactions. I mean, this political stuff is a great example of families breaking up over it. You know, like people not talking in their families anymore and stuff over politics, which is weird. It’s crazy. Because when I think about it, too, like this, how often has real politics affected your life, real politics that affect your life? are the ones down at city hall that you’re involved with? That’s what matters not? who’s in the White House doesn’t really affect you? Yeah, vocal elections. Right. But that all gets mixed up. Because for some reason, for some reason, they’re just not passing the $1.9 trillion stimulus. They’ve been talking about that for like a year mots. Yeah. Just in in Justin’s election just passed. Right. They have control of the Senate, the Democrats have control of the Senate. Right. And it still took months. And now the output is like, what most of these like countries around the world get per month, anyway, automatically. You know what? I’m not saying that should be giving away money. I’m not a big fan of that either. Yeah, but but it’s just like, all this time to finally get 1400 bucks for some people. Yeah. What I think is just like,

Unknown Speaker 21:59
what are what are they really doing there? And those positions, they give me a lot of money to like, just go through a lot of jargon and all types of different systems and processes and stuff. And we can get to a way to cut through all of that malarkey, and say, Hey, let’s come to the table. What do we need to get done to get, you know, like, we’re not going to agree to everything, but we need to fix this economy. What is the best way to do this? Does that need to take two months to agree to something? That’s what’s crazy? Don’t you feel like it’s a matter of kind of not? It’s hard to pick steps of action plan or whatever, if we don’t have a common understanding of where we want to go? You know, like, obviously, it would help tender to believe where we’re at or to understand that where we’re at together, those are two separate right now. Yeah, like me. And you think one thing? I think one thing you think one thing, the left thinks one side, the right things one side, we can’t even agree on where we’re at. And how are we going to move forward if we don’t agree where we’re at? And then of course, the bigger picture is, where are we gonna end up at? And like, if we can agree on those, how are we going to agree on an action plan? Yeah, I agree. I think it’s a multifaceted. Yeah, discussion and topic that has so many different layers where we could cover it in the ad, it’s no way we can, you know,

Unknown Speaker 23:19
Cocker that in the attic, we would need, they would need textbooks and a staff of at least 100 researchers and, and that’s just insane. Like, when I was younger, I always would just think about things like,

Unknown Speaker 23:34
always thought, I don’t know if you ever had this thought,

Unknown Speaker 23:37
like, why is there money? I remember I asked my mom one time, like, well, I feel like that’s like causing all the problems. Why do we even have money? You know what I mean? And I feel like sometimes, I harken back and feel myself being that kid again and be like, Why do we have senators? They don’t get anything done. Right. You know what I mean, right? At the end of the day, like there’s something with that the stalemate and all of the different things that came over, like let’s reform that in a way where we can actually have actual legislation. I don’t care what what passes. Let’s just get more things passed. It’s got to be moving. Yeah, exactly. It’s all these it’s all these stall tactics and filibusters and all this like procedural nonsense. I stopped I stopped watching the news recently, man after the political cycle, I just couldn’t take it anymore. But you I feel like you have the makeup. You have the background now to with being a probation officer, you should be a local politician honestly know that you’d want to be but you would be good man. You’d be good for the same reason. You’d be a good probation officer.

Kirk Ross 24:34
Man, you’d be a good mouthpiece for for an underrepresented community.

Montay Lee 24:39
That might be true in so many ways, but I feel like

being a politician in a way that I would want to be what probably lead to like canceled culture, some type of way because I feel like once you get into that realm, people start throwing money at you in all different types of ways and then you can

Gotta eventually like you, you say, This is what I want to do, you know, I want to like raise minimum wage or whatever, whatever your stances, whatever your stances, you know. And eventually, people chip away at it in so many ways and say, well, like No, instead of having to be 15, why don’t we go to 14? And then I’ll let you do this, though. And then I’ll get you the sponsors. And before you know what you’re back now until 11. Yeah. So it’s just like, it’s a lot of like political maneuvering. I don’t know how well I would do with that. You’d be driving a Rolls Royce. Like, I just wanted to raise the minimum wage. You know what I mean? And now, you know, I’m

promoting Super PACs. All it is. And you know what I mean, the minimum wage is 50 cent more than what you guys originally had that we voted Montay Lee, and he actually dropped minimum wage, and now he’s driving a Rolls Royce. Exactly. And now I’m speaking from a teleprompter during all of my, you know, like, worse than that.

Kirk Ross 25:54
Well, I already know speeches, I already know that you’re not going to fall victim to that because you look, let’s talk about your creative endeavors. And so this is more than creative endeavors. You’re, you’re super into fitness. We’ll talk about that.

You’re also you’ve started your own podcast called Karat Juice that spelled like diamond karat.

Montay Lee 26:11

Kirk Ross 26:12
I like that. Absolutely. I like that. It’s a good logo. It’s cool. We’ll talk about that. But we in the capacity of you becoming a politician and end up being a sellout or whatever, whatever could happen. Yeah, you haven’t been a sellout with your fitness stuff. Right? We talked about this before we started recording. So how do you manage? You have a bit, tell a little bit about your fitness part of it. And like, the videos that you created and all that. And then let’s talk about how is that something that you want to monetize? What is the passion behind that? What is all that?

Montay Lee 26:40
Yeah, so about, I want to say about two years ago, I, I had always been into fitness for the most part, like, well, you played basketball in college. Yep, play basketball in college. At caper, I was an undersized, big man 6565 and a half with shoes on. And I played sinner. You know, and I was undersized. But I worked hard. And I played hard. And I always had been into, you know, that competitive nature of things. So I took that mentality that I had playing college basketball, and I just

threw that into my fitness because for me, the fitness side of things, it’s not a physical thing for me, it’s more a mental thing for me it, it literally is my therapy. When I go in there, I just feel, you know, a sense of it is it’s like meditation for me. So I did that for years after graduating college and graduating from college in 2014. And then two years ago, I decided to start my lifestyle brand, Natty fits. And that stands for natural fitness. And pretty much my whole goal with that it wasn’t to monetize it or make any money. I just wanted to show people what I was doing what I have been doing for years and how it’s affected my life and helped me to be, you know, the person that I am now. Yeah, and it’s really tied to an around just taking care of yourself each and every day and not cutting any corners with anything. Like natural fitness means like I cook my own meals, for the most part I don’t take any supplements never have because first of all, when I first started, I didn’t money wasn’t growing on trees. And those supplements are expensive, right? Yeah, you had no choice you were natural by by requirement at the beginning, man, when I first like got into the weightlifting stuff, I never liked the way people looked when they took that stuff, they look kind of puffy, like their muscles by like, you wouldn’t see any veins, they would just kind of look like Johnny Bravo. You know, no veins on their arms, but they’re super big. And I was like, I don’t want to look like that. And I think something it’s something to do with the either the creatine or the whey protein, it’s like adds water, like a water layer in between your muscle and your skin. So I never wanted to get to that. And first of all, I couldn’t afford it went into GNC.

And some of the stuff that the guy was trying to push me they always try to push you like the really good stuff. Is this a mineral most expensive shit at the time? That and all that. And then it was like $90 for like a Yeah, a thing. And I was just like, No, I’m just going to eat some chicken and rice and broccoli. So that’s what I kept doing. And what I realized is most of that stuff is bullshit, dude. Like, yeah, it might help like somebody if you’re trying to be a bodybuilder, but who I wasn’t trying to be a bodybuilder. I feel like for most people, including for myself, it’s like a device to it’s like an investment in yourself. So then you’re like, Well, I didn’t buy those pills. I didn’t think I better start working out now. It’s almost like that. But other than once that value is gone. It’s like, I honestly feel like it’s placebo. It is dude that night, they put a little nitrous shit in there so that you get that nitric oxide oxide sheet so you get like that flush feeling. You know, I’m talking about the but a lot of them have caffeine in it. So yeah, literally, you could just take some take some coffee, so that’s what I would do. I would literally drink some some

coffee before working out. And then I got into posting all of these videos on Instagram that showing like, how to do the workouts because so many people do things the wrong way. Yeah, just from misinformation out there, or the best thing ever, all the freakin ego lifters that go to the gym and they haven’t been there in like you know a couple of months but they’re trying to deadlift 250 like a jackass, come on yeah, you don’t do that like the main thing that I always stress like through all of my content is just be realistic about where you are, start at a very comfortable weight so that you can actually manage and build yourself up. So the process of the natty fits whole thing it wasn’t about trying to bulk up and get super huge, fast, it’s sustainable. It’s something that you can consistently do. And if you consistently do it every week workout five days a week, you would get natural lean muscle that you would keep literally during the pandemic I didn’t work out for like

when the gyms were closed here in Michigan. I didn’t work out for like six months. That’s how you had to be pulling your hair out. Yeah, well, you actually did pull your hair out. Yeah, it was crazy. I cut it

busted off myself. It was crazy. Because I didn’t have that mental outlet to do what I wanted to do. But I didn’t lose that much muscle mass at all. Yeah, cuz it’s like true real muscle is real, real muscle. That’s one thing I noticed people will look at me and be like, you’re not working out. It’s like no, yeah, I got a little bit of a belly because I was eating some snacks. You know, it hasn’t. But that’s one thing I really believed in. I believe that. It’s something about doing it naturally. And getting it gradually that you will keep it and you like like yeah, earn this. I didn’t just like buy it. Yeah, you know, off the shelf. Because who wants to get that big? Really? Like you can’t even wipe your butt. Man. I know you’re too big like, I think like my goal for the whole working out thing and stuff is to get like tight in in the NFL. Like

Best I Can LeBron James tight. Such a low standard, but he’s not jet like. Exactly. Bron James is tall too, though. But LeBron James is. Was he to 16 move. He’s six, nine. He’s 266. Nine to 66. Five to 40 not the same as him anyway. I want to be able to move and be functional. You know, cuz everyone’s while you still got to be able to dance if you go out.

Kirk Ross 32:20
Come on. Yeah.

Montay Lee 32:22
Like, too big. That wasn’t my goal. Not bodybuilding. That’s why I quit working out guys. I was just getting too strong.

So yeah, that’s kind of like how I got into the Natty Ftz thing.

Kirk Ross 32:31
And I really enjoyed I liked your content on that. Yeah, it was fun.

Montay Lee 32:35
Yeah, it was a good time. I didn’t take myself too seriously with it. And I got a lot of people reaching out with questions and stuff like that. So I was able to like scratch that itch of just helping people feel better, because it’s my mental, you know, therapy, and you’re in because of your interest in that you’re an expert on it. And you’re also an influential guy just because of your positivity and the way you handle yourself. And so we want to see stuff from you, you know, like, people look to you, even friends and people that don’t know, you probably look to you more often than other friends because of the type of guy you are. Yeah, so why not share? I get that a lot. And I think it’s something about seeing it from somebody that you know, that’s in the community and saying like, Oh, I can see that he’s doing it rather than some like, you know, person that’s got all the money in the world to get like all these crazy trainers. And yeah, that like newsflash people, the people that you see on Instagram, for the most part, they got like the 10, pack abs and everything like that they had those before the fat burning protein.

So you know, it’s not like they just got a little chubby for the before picture. And anybody that’s trying to tell you that you can get like a spot, a spot like Oh, remove your love handles or remove your abs is one, belly flat. Impossible. You cannot remove belly fat from spot training or a certain type of supplement, you have to get rid of it through your diet, caloric deficit, and working out moving your butt. That’s the only way you can get rid of it. Anybody else that’s saying anything else is not? Well, it’s also nice too, because like for instance, you came here tonight and I asked you we want you got pizza. You know, you didn’t like crushed about the pizza. But like that’s kind of helpful too to say like, okay, it’s not like you’re some maniacal guy only eating broccoli nine, nine times a week and like, that’s all you’re gonna have and like, do you know, what is the point in working all the time if you can’t eat good? Work? Oh, it’s

good. Like, okay, I’ll work out a lot so I can eat. I’m a foodie. I love food. Talk about that. Dude. I love food. I love to cook I was the weird kid growing up who? I used to watch the Food Network for fun. Have you ever been to flavortown I haven’t.

Kirk Ross 34:42
what’s that guy’s gone diamonds and drive

Montay Lee 34:48
to flavor it. But I love that type of food though. Oh yeah. diners and stuff and like that really good diner that’s here. In gr Schnitz Deli.

Kirk Ross 34:58
Oh yeah, the one on Fulton right here. Yeah.

Montay Lee 35:00
The Big John, one of the best sandwiches I’ve never gotten it. What is it? It’s like a Philly cheesesteak, but it has like carmelized onions in it with the provolone with bacon, kind of like the old Big John steak and onion. If you ever had one of those, that was an old restaurant, we had one out in the Bay City secondaria dude, but it’s like two mils. For me, it’s one. But for the normal human being, it’s two mil for someone that’s not going to go work out for two hours after they eat it. It’s one two meals. Absolutely. What was that? Oh, food food. So I used to watch like emerald Lagasse on Food Network. I really got into just like watching recipes and stuff. So growing up, I started cooking meals for our household, because I used to do it so good. Like when I was like 11, or 12, and it’s just what is the dynamic your household? How many siblings parents would have the situation? Well, my mom and my dad got divorced when I was like two or three, but they’re both my life. Yeah, let’s go. Yeah, so my life gray. He got remarried. But I have two brothers, three sisters. And where are you in there? In the middle in the middle? I’m in the middle. So I started cooking for everybody. Everybody started loving the food AM. I used to love I love to make tacos. American tacos for the most part at that point, which is like the ground beef. Yeah. yellow corn shelter tea. You know, lettuce, green, red, yellow peppers, onions, sour cream, I would make my own gwoc. And then if you haven’t had it, have your nachos with Doritos. Oh, wow. So you take the spicy Nacho Doritos, or the nacho cheese Doritos that you put your ground beef and Oh, with the ground beef too.

You got to strain your ground beef people public service announcement. If anybody cooks you some tacos and then they cook up the beef.

Kirk Ross 36:52

Montay Lee 36:53
And you know how it has the different lean properties like where it’s like 70% or 30%? Yes, sometimes people will cook that forget to strain it and then put in the sauce or whatever and then you’re eating. You’re eating a grease taco. Yes. That’s the reason why strain it after you brown it. Okay, public service. Finally. Yes, you have to do that. Real time you do that. You put your meat down there you put all your condiments everything sharp cheddar cheese, drizzle it over, toasted, toasted, do not put it into microwave, toast it in the oven. So then your chips are still crispy. montae special for the nationals you put on bright you put it up on low broil or what do you do you put it I just put on like 353 75 for a couple of minutes. Cover it with oil? No. Okay, folks, we’re gonna take a break right now. But I just want to remind you that it’s only in the attic, and only on this podcast to talk in the attic where someone could be preaching fitness and then there’s moments later talking about a Dorito taco or dreena with nachos. Rito nachos. Maybe so don’t say that. Don’t say that. There’s no variation here. We’ll be right back things never be the same never be the same again.

Kirk Ross 38:22
Alright, here we are. We’re back.

Montay Lee 38:24
That was Thundercat?

Yes, that was Thundercat dude. Yes. What so what kind of music do you listen to in general?

I’m, I’m a very soulful, chill guy, your cat? Dragonball durag? One of my favorite songs. What’s the one that we just listened to? What’s the second one that you told me? Oh, fair chance. Yeah, fair chance. Ty Dolla Sign. Tight. Album. It’s good. That’s my guy. I haven’t heard that. No. Is that the featuring one? Well, I don’t know. I saw my Tiny Desk concert. He was playing new songs. Yeah. Did you see that? That? That? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so I like people like that Ty Dolla Sign.

I like… I listen to rap, right. I listen to r&b but I really liked the artists that are in between they’re like to me.

Kirk Ross 39:10
Yes, I was gonna say him.

It’s on so I’m headed to win Wow. Just to be off of rivets in with forgiveness asleep she she go vegan on a weak his hand. I don’t think I know. All the different girls that he know I love.

Montay Lee 39:29
You got to check out he’s one of my faves. Dude. I like the artists artists. Like Ty Dolla Sign is not a singer. He’s not a rapper. He’s in between. St. Khadi. Yes. The new one. I haven’t listened to that much though. Do you like it? Generally, the only one I’ve really listened to so far was the one with Eminem where it’s like the Moon Man and Slim Shady. It’s pretty cool. Pretty cool. I’m not saying like a top off of the brand or the Wayne weight. Lift off cancer the —- growth but again, moving

Unknown Speaker 40:00
Man on the Moon like the first man on the moon, pursuit of happiness, oh my god, I have so many memories of dancing with you. They played that they played pursuit of happiness at Eve every Friday night like without fail. I remember dancing. There was like that EDM version of it to really like Wahby like, anytime you hear that, like people talk about music, and how it like makes you like traveled in time and like the nostalgia and stuff. Anytime I hear that it just like takes me back I get like Foosball when you picture doing like and drills in the gym question blow

Unknown Speaker 40:33
up taking

Unknown Speaker 40:36
2am summer night I don’t care hand on the wheel driving drunk I’m doing my thing

Unknown Speaker 40:44
my life cannot dream. No, it just makes me feel good. It’s just a happy like anytime somebody leaves that public gathering everybody just looks around everybody thought bossa nova dot and everybody just gets happy. Very happy. That’s type of music

Kirk Ross 41:08
I like that. Future. Yeah. Is though. I love his sandals. Sandals, man.

Montay Lee 41:14
So let’s see. Okay, so Karat Juice, your first episode, the first if you gave a little intro on yourself, which was great, folks, go to the show notes, you’ll see links to, to Montay his podcast called Karat Juice. I don’t know when by the time this drops, you’ll have five or six episodes out probably by then. But whatever the case, check them out. But the first on your first episode you talked about future so talking about this story? I didn’t know about it. Oh, yeah. So as I usually do, I was perusing you know, the news. You know, I gotta check my I have a guilty pleasure. I like to see what’s going on in the world. And I scrolled past an article that talked about future Hendricks talking about future, buying some sandals. And the caveat to this is these sandals are made of their Birkenstocks. Right. Everybody’s seen girls walk around with Birkenstocks, right, the 120 bucks out the door. I really like I really like when a girl wears some Birkenstocks, though, especially if she’s curvy with some legs. It’s something about it. I really like it. But these weren’t those.

Unknown Speaker 42:20
He bought some Birkenstocks that were made out of actual Birkin bags, which is B E, RK, isn’t it? Or is it b i R? Well isn’t so there’s whatever it’s the opposite isn’t an opposite. It’s not the same spelling is Birkenstock, obviously, don’t know about it, because I never been anywhere near the store. Right? It’s not it’s not my life. cross chain our way to the flow. What do you explain the construction of it obviously became obvious where the price came from like that. So they’re $48,000. Yes. Right. And that’s when they’re like, that’s the mid tier. They got ones that are higher than that. But then when you explain the construction of it, you said it’s a standard basically a standard Birkenstock foot. Yeah. So and then then what do they what do they like literally cut out the molding of where his you know, feet will like sit with actual Birkin bag material that was already created into a Birkin bag, though. Yeah, they constructed it. Yeah. That’s so silly. Like they could have just gotten the material from the jump. Like the only reason that expensive is because we’re paying people to like deconstruct an old an expensive bag, but my only thing is like, what is it about the Birkin because the leather is not like, it’s not like a mate. Okay, it’s a leather might be amazing. But it’s no leather still. Even if it is quality leather. I’m pretty sure the same leather that’s in your couch or something. It’s still leather. Right? What how can you make something that expensive? So I went off on a tangent about that because it’s the consumerism in the world today is just getting crazy because you’re not they’re not paying for that material are not that it’s the name. Yeah, it’s because other people will buy it and respect the brand status thing that it gets to go. There. I just $48,000 I never paid over two grand for a pair sandals. Tops. I never paid over $200 for anything. No, no, I know. I was totally joking about two great sandals. They’re not even full of shoes. No, I’m not paying 40 grand anything less than a full wing tip. I do like I do like a good boot. I like a good like chuckle boot or something like that. But like check it out. I think my cut off is $300 Yeah, it’s really silly. And I only get stuff on sale. I only buy like never buy something full price. Now this is more this is a little bit trickier for males like you and I are but I’m a big I like thrift shopping a lot. And there’s a lot of good thrift shops around Grand Rapids I don’t know if it’s because I don’t know they’re just and

Unknown Speaker 44:51
but men stuff at thrift shop tends to be like really worn out. Like guys worship forever. They don’t like girls. You can get stuff in the women’s section. It has like tags

Unknown Speaker 45:00
Got it still? Isn’t that the purpose of the thrift shop though? Don’t you want the worn in? In some cases? Yeah, but Jessica will find like, Dude, we find like 800 pairs, we find like $800 pairs of jeans sometimes. Like at random thrift shops for three bucks. Wow. And so like she’ll sell them on Poshmark or whatever, you know, which is kind of like an eBay for clothes or whatever. Wow. But when guys stuff you rarely find anything like that. I won’t be able to find anything that fits me. It’s my shoe sizes. 13 Me too. How could you fit? I know what don’t go to the shopping is we’re gonna be competing for all the 13 don’t you’re gonna hate it? Definitely. No, I don’t.

Unknown Speaker 45:36
I can tell you last time I bought clothes, man. I’m bought clothes so long. That’s a problem of staying kind of consistently fit like you have you don’t really change size. I have to like constantly get like smaller clothes and bigger clothes. And then well, you just always the same. Well, I worked at Banana Republic. When I first started working at the court and I did it part time just to get close. And because you get 50% ALL Yeah, that’s a good part of working there. So the whole time I was working there for like a year or whatever. I didn’t make any money because all my money went to the clothes, but you’re still rocking that wardrobe. Yep. Still because this stuff lasts forever. Yeah, that’s one of the they have like for guys that are 6364 and like they have a good length of arms and shit. Like it actually fits me.

Unknown Speaker 46:16
I know the exact size so like, I’m the kind of person I do like quality things. But once I get something that’s quality, I’m gonna I’m gonna be one of those people that’s gonna wear it out. Yeah. How long would you have to wear future sandals? Birkin sandals? Before you think that you get your value out of them you have to wear them for every every day forever.

Unknown Speaker 46:37
I walk to California and those things

Unknown Speaker 46:41
$48,000 Dude that is a BMW truck I could never I could never put them on. Even if somebody gifted it to me I can never been more No, I’m not putting my stinky foot in that thing.

Unknown Speaker 46:52
How much what kind of shoes it you know kind of shoes that you when you were a team shoe? Is that like hyper probably? I want to say we have like the Nike like hyper dunks. Is he still you still rock those

Unknown Speaker 47:04
like playing ball or does he still play ball? I still play ball. I’m more rocking the Kyrie Irving’s and stuff right now. But the shoes that I have. I’ve had for like two years. The basketball shoes. We haven’t been playing them. There’s been a pandemic. Yeah, but I only wear like my basketball shoes only warm inside. Yeah, true. You know what I mean? Yeah, like so. I used to play and Gus Macker tournament. The three on threes outside? I haven’t been doing that recently. She used to go to Ludington one right? Yeah, that was a fun one but that’ll scuff the crap out of your shoes not to mention the fight the fights that are brought breakout. That guy got really bad so that’s why I stopped going to that one. So now I only play in like the ones that like her around here. Yeah, that is a good time. They are fun though. Yeah, they’re fun. I got like a lot of friends that do it. So it was just like a social thing to get to be able to catch up with friends and then you also get to do a couple of up and unders and pump fix.

Unknown Speaker 47:59
Oh man game. I can tell you have to be six five playing center in college you have to beat snake people would be like dunk it I’ll be like not today. I’m all day. Yeah, like my game. My game is a in college. It was a

Unknown Speaker 48:15
Division three. college level. Tim Duncan. Oh, the big fundamental. Yeah, that’s what that’s what they call me.

Unknown Speaker 48:22
Did all kinds of pump fakes and up and unders and stuff. I appreciate that. That’s a game that translates deep into your 60s as well. You can keep that game go spurs go. So I have a question for you. What is Karat Juice and kind of how did that all come about? So I remember when I was in college, growing up and first discovering audio books when I was working on the on the summers as a landscaper. And if you haven’t done landscape in Michigan, in you know, August. It is super hot, super humid. So I’d be literally like digging holes, trenches, doing all types of different landscape like hard labor hard love, loved it. Yeah, it was great. It was something about going to a place and seeing it one way and then seeing dirt and dust and then when you leave it’s all beautiful and pretty with like, you know, mulch beds and plants and everything. So I really enjoyed that work. But while I was doing that, I would listen to audiobooks. It started with audio books. What was your first book, my first book that I really got into and I listened to was actually Stephen King. audiobook. It was a spooky, really, I love scary stuff. But if you read that one Oh, yeah, I’ve seen the second one. And what was that us us who read who reads that one? Do you know? Is it Stephen King? No, I want to say it’s like Grover gardener. I thought you’re gonna say Gilbert Godfrey for a second. No. Grover gardener. He does a lot of the horror stuff and stuff but he has like a really he’s really good at doing the inflection. So the different you know, yeah, characters and stuff, but this is like a 52 hour

Unknown Speaker 50:00
audiobook that’s a whole week. It’s that’s literally why I did it. It’s a whole week of work. Because like, most of the time, you know, the person that I’m working with, they’re operating heavy machinery and stuff. And then I’m doing all this stuff. So I’m by myself a lot, you know? Yeah, getting it in. So I started listening to that audio book, and I just fell in love with, you know, the story like, the story was so well done. So well produced that eventually, it was like, I was hearing a movie, right? Like, live, you were imagining it and all that. Yeah, I literally left like my body and where I was at, and I was in the story. Yeah, that’s like, where my love of audio just like, eventually came from. Right? And did you know what at the time that that’s what was happening? Or were you just thinking this is an enjoyable thing, I just know that like, there’s something about being in somebody’s head literally. And getting that story, it’s the most like one of the most intimate forms of media that you can have. Because if somebody is willing to take the time, to listen to you, and to go about their day, and to really like sit there with you, you can really have a story a story takes hold way better in audio form. Yeah, if somebody is willing to get there. I agree. Like, it’s, it’s, it’s kind of hard to explain. I agree. Because it’s like, it forces you to use your own imagination to some, so you’re participating in a more absolute, you know, whereas if you’re watching and something like even, I kind of like sometimes putting the captions on a lot of times putting the captions on the TV, particularly because like, when I read it, then I kind of get it gets me into more of a reading vibe, or I’m picturing it more instead of just letting the movie do the work or whatever. Yeah, you know, awesome. Yeah. Do you think like,

Unknown Speaker 51:39
well, first off, was it highly produced? Like, from a sound design perspective? Was there like sound effects and stuff in it? And all that? Or was it just being read? You remember, it was just being read. And that’s pretty wild. We can go there just with that. There was no sound effects and stuff, because I felt like the sound effects and stuff would have took away from it, honestly, yeah, with that, because my mind had the sound effects and everything going on. And to piggyback on the reason why I fell in love with the audio. I love that I can I’m a multitasker. So I love that I can be working during I want to read this. Listen, it’s not something I got to pay attention to. Right? Because I’ve tried reading. And yeah, I do read from time to time, and I’ve read some really good books over the time, but who has the time to sit on a, you know, coffee chair and read, when I will put on an audio book, I could just go about like, you know, cleaning or you know, just going about my day to do. And that’s where the love of that develop. And then I always said, when I was growing up that eventually I want to write a book. So the Karat Juice was actually going to be the name of my first book. It still can be Yeah, and it. It can’t be but I’m kind of treating it like a book. Yeah. That’s the pages are being, you know, produced one episode at a time. I love it. And my thoughts? And why? Why is it called Karat Juice? The first time when I first came up with that it was carrot ca RR OT. And I thought about that. Because I didn’t want my book title to be a book title that was like,

Unknown Speaker 53:12
the magnificent life. You know, Harley Quinn or whatever, you know exactly what it is, right? I wanted it to be like yesterday’s, what’s that about? Yeah, it’d be completely something different than what it is. So that’s like where it started. But now fast forward to the podcast, the main thing that I want to get accomplished with this, it’s just getting my thoughts out there. outlet to be able to, you know, talk about whatever I want to talk about real and authentically. And eventually, when I have kids, I don’t have any kids now. But eventually, when I have kids, I think it’s gonna be really cool. And I always thought that I don’t want to leave this world and not leave anything behind. And for sure, a book is something that will always be there. So that’s kind of like the thing behind it like this podcast, you know, my podcast, it’s kind of sweet to think that you’re doing something that’s gonna always be there. So when I think about it, I think about being able to share this with my kids when they’re, it’s cool able to, to hear it to be like, This is what your dad thought about this topic. is real.

Unknown Speaker 54:15

Unknown Speaker 54:17
All the shit that like,

Unknown Speaker 54:19
I think that you and I are on the right side of most of this stuff. Right? Yeah. But there’s undoubtedly, without a doubt some positions that we’re going to take on our own individual podcast. That won’t be like looked down upon in 100 years. You don’t I’m saying like, but even if they are. I don’t care about it. Yeah, I think it’s cool. But this is the thing, even if there are it’ll, and your thoughts can change. Yeah, it’s literally every one of these podcasts and the way I’m looking at it with my podcast as well. You’re taking a snapshot of where you are where Montay Lee is at that moment in time. Right What I thought and eventually I’m gonna evolve with life experience and everything you’re gonna change but it’s, it’s a moment in time of this is where I

Unknown Speaker 55:00
was at this Yemen, of course, you’re not going to think that same way. Or you might write but at least you got documentation of this is where I was at at this moment. And what’s what’s more intimate, what’s something that’s more cool than being able to give something like that to the future generations to say, this is what I thought about these things. And that’s cool. That’s really cool. So it’s not fake, or anything like that, or watered down, it could just be raw for them. So when I think about it, I think about it like that. I’m talking to future generations about how I feel about the world and things like that. And hopefully they get some value out of it. If one person gets value out of it. Yeah. Then I’m happy. Well, folks, go listen to Karat Juice and also go write a review on Apple for Well, hold on. Don’t write a review for Karat Juice until you’ve written a review for this show. Yeah, I’ve got about 7071 reviews. I have 150 200 people listening each time. So there’s a disconnect. Okay. Absolutely. Once you do that, though, go also render view for Karat Juice.

Montay Lee 56:00
But, yeah, so also, one thing I’ve realized with Karat Juice, and just with podcasting in general, I feel like far too often in today’s day and age, we just don’t have enough conversations like this, right. And I’m from I was born in 88. So I’m from a generation, like, right before, everything hit the fan. So like, I remember having to call like a girl that I like, I remember having to call her dad, her dad might answer on the house. And then her mom answered, like, his little home, or just hanging out. You know, I remember that. And then I remember, you know, like the onset of MySpace and Facebook and all that. And then smartphones and everything where we’re at now, I still believe that there’s something about the one on one being able to talk to somebody in person, which is starting to get lost in today’s day, and it’s fortunately and even accelerated fashion now that the pandemic and stuff that’s like accelerated slowly, some people they have, and I like texting, it’s convenient, but I’m not a big texter. Like my girlfriend gets all my gets on me all the time. She say, you don’t text me enough, and all this stuff like that. But it’s just like, I would rather call you have a conversation, right? Because in today’s day and age, I feel like so many people, they’re just having their entire, you know, dating conversation and everything via text. So being able to use my voice and speak to people and to engage in conversation, because eventually, I want the conversation and not just be one sided. So I’m going to add things in there for sure. In my content that’s interactive. Yeah, in any way I can. Because at the end of the day, I’m a people person, I want to connect with people. Right? Right, of course. Absolutely. So I’m noticing kind of a pattern. Maybe this is off air. But you talked about how your Karat Juice your main thing right now is you want to make sure you’re consistent. So can you preach a little bit about why it’s consistency important? Because it’s also your sustainable fitness motto as well. You know, none of this stuff for you is really like, yeah, you’re gonna do it for a while and be done. It’s all kind of like a Steady, sustainable thing that really like shape, or is that being shaped by your worldview, or by lessons you learned as a kid? Or how did you get that? That’s an important thing that you’re disciplined ultimately, yeah, you’re a disciplined person. And I struggle with this. Everyone struggles with discipline so people can learn from you. How do you maintain your discipline? Well, we were talking a bit off here, what I was mainly talking about is like anything that you start, for sure.

Kirk Ross 58:38
You can’t just look for gratification right away and think that that’s going to be the end all be all, when you first start with anything, there’s going to be trial and error, you’re going to figure out what works, what doesn’t like I have already.

Montay Lee 58:52
But I feel like with anything that you do, especially if you have a passionate about it, are passionate about it. The consistency is what what’s gonna hold true over time, because you made up in your mind, I made up in my mind that I’m going to do this, and I’m going to see it through. Because that’s setting the example for future generations, people who look up to you.

And if you just want to do something like I’m never going to be somebody who’s just going to quit something that I want to do because I’m not getting the result that I want right away. Delayed gratification, you know, if then when you eventually get to where you want to be, you’ll be ready for it. I think right now, because I’m just starting out with this. Yeah, the messages that I need to formulate and how I need to put it together the perfect way. It’s not meant to hit those ears that it’s going to hit a year and a half, two years from now. I’m with you 100% Somebody that really needed to hear the message that I need to that I’m that’s in me to get out. Nice to hear it. I don’t think it needs to hit that person’s ear until like a year year and a half now when I’m sharpened, you know. So word has been you know, finely tuned. So I

Think that repetition. Without repetition, I’m only going to get better as a speaker on how to formulate my thoughts and make it concise and clear.

All of that is tied to that consistency piece. And then the way it shaped my worldview, literally just was is that did it shape your worldview? Or did your worldview get shaped by that? Like, what came first? I guess like your work? Have you always been a guy that like focus on consistency? I guess I’ve always been somebody that if I say, I’m going to do something, I’m going to try to do it to the best of my ability, no matter what, even if I feel like I don’t fear failure. I fear not trying. Because I fear I feel like so often.

people, myself included, so often when I was younger, I would say, I’m going to do this. And then I’ll put it off, put it off, put it off, put it off, but like when you say you’re going to do something, just get it started, get the ball rolling, and then don’t be afraid to fail. Yeah, you know, I feel like in today’s culture in today’s society,

Kirk Ross 1:01:04
so many people get, you know, what’s the best word trapped by indecision and error analysis on? Is this gonna sound the right way? Is this gonna be the right way? Just gonna do? Like, no, just just star our talking.

This is what this I like to tell people in the same dude, you and I are exactly to get lockstep on this. It’s like, you’re not ready now. Yeah, I’m not ready now, either. I’m a lot more ready than I was a year ago when I started this. Absolutely. You know what, I’m gonna be a lot more ready in a year from now. Whenever I look back and listen to my old stuff, I’m like, oh, man, I should have done this better that, but that’s part of it. Exactly. And by the way, you don’t really know where your limit is until you fail. Like if you if you just walk through life, and no one has this experience. But if someone just walks through life and never meets failure, then they really don’t know what it takes really to win. They know that or they know in those cases, they did more than they had to to win. But that doesn’t really teach you where your limit really is. Right? Yeah, absolutely. It’s like like you lost. Did you guys were you guys successful like Kuyper?

Montay Lee 1:02:05
Yeah NO, like, Oh, dude, my freshman year. We were really bad. That’s the thing like that was probably your first experience being on a really bad team probably right. I didn’t even tell you this in high school. I played JV as a junior because my first two years fresh. I mean, I was a freshman and sophomore in high school. I didn’t try out. I just played with my friends. junior year, I tried out I made JV. And then my senior year I try it out. And I got cut from my high school team. What was your like, MJ? In a way?

So did you did you like start getting more serious in the weight room after that, or something or what happened? I just got it. I just had a huge chip on my shoulder after getting cut my senior year. And I think that’s one of the best things that ever happened to me in my life because it forced me to work and not feel like anything gets handed over to me. That’s a failure right there. I had this huge chip on my shoulder playing in college. And yeah, my first two years, I got beat, like we got beat up. I was a skinny, scrawny kid at that time. But then I got in the weight room every year. And I continued to work on my game and got better. And I always had that chip on my shoulder that I got cut. And it literally propelled me for so by my senior year, we were actually really good. We were number one in the nation and our division. Yeah. At towards the end of the year. And I actually was an all American, my senior year in college. Dude, that’s a great, that’s like, well, that’s awesome. But it’s like, encapsulates Exactly. We’re just talking about, like the failure. It’s not for stuff. It wasn’t a failure that you got kind of just is what it was. But if not for that, I wouldn’t you want to push yourself like I wouldn’t, I wouldn’t have at all. And I’m thankful for those experiences, because they have shaped me into the person that I am right now. And a person like, I love media, like I said, and podcasts and everything. I really follow somebody named Charlemagne. Oh, I know. Sure. Charlamagne tha god yeah, of course, one of the things that he says all the time that I always think of my head is you’re never as great as they say you are and you’re never as bad as they say you are somewhere in the middle. So I try to keep that, in my mind. Stay level headed, because he doesn’t think too highly of himself. And he’s doing big things. And he’s always somebody that you know, is listening to others and learning growth. So with that type of mindset, that’s kind of like how I’m moving through the world now is I’m always trying to learn and get better and they’re never as good as you say you are they’re never as bad as you say you are you’re somewhere in the middle. Yeah, that’s a great that’s a great mindset man and the great attitude it’s it kind of feels like that that’s the issue now that’s happening in the media and stuff is everyone’s jumping to everyone’s got to jump to like the pole side of it, like the far left or far right. Not even political, but like yeah, no one’s really trying to remember like, it’s that person’s not the worst person ever live and they’re not the best. No, we’re all kind of in the middle. We’re all fucking there’s a nuance in the middle for the reasons why people do and say what they do. So I always like to prod and ask questions in any situation like that.

Kirk Ross 1:05:00
Like, what happened here? What did the person say? You know what I mean? There’s always more to it. It’s never cut and dry. Never, ever with anything in life. No. It’s like you talked about earlier in your even in your probate work or you talk or your probation work or you talked about, someone reacts to you all snippy it’s, you’re aware at that point that it’s okay, something probably far worse than what I just said happened to them. That’s what that’s where that’s coming from.

Montay Lee 1:05:26
It’s not me, I don’t know you. I don’t know you. It’s not me that you’re angry at there’s obviously something that happened. And it’s not on me to react with anger. Because so often in those situations, people react with anger and it escalates the situation. Yeah, then no, you’re fighting about is the stuff that you said, after you’re mad, nothing even to do with the core issue, tension in the room and all that stuff that doesn’t need to be there. Instead, if you actually listen, I try to listen to people and hear them and hear, like, really, actually actively listen, and figure out what this person is trying to convey to me. You know, and I try I take my emotions out of it, you know, it’s nothing personal or anything like that. And then I try to respond there with goal in mind being how can we, you know, add value to this person find a solution have a better version of themselves? Yeah, if you look at it like that, you know, look at it with your ego, and your feelings. You, you will be successful in your interaction with that person, no matter what, even if it’s a tense situation, because personally, people always ask me like, do why don’t you ever seem like you’re angry? Why don’t you ever seem like things are out of you? Because I look at it through that lens. I can just take things in and not have my ego involved. And it helps me to be a way better, you know, communicated with people in those tents, situation, I feel like I thrive in those tents. Do you ever have? Do you ever lose it? Like in in your person? Maybe not in your professional world? Like in your personal life? Is it ever harder? So you just have that natural disposition? Or I’ve always had that natural disposition? Sometimes it makes people angry? Yeah. When you’re when I’m not upset, and when I’m not showing that much emotion?

Yeah, because it’s just like, I’m, I’m looking at it through that lens. So I’ve gotten some pushback a bit. Because of that, because it’s just like, hey, like, why don’t you ever get you know what I mean? But I turn up hot takes out there guys might let Montay stay even keel we need that we need more exactly. Like, I’ll save it for the hot takes. But like, I think having that kind of perspective when it comes to things that are coming at me and also the profession that I’m in always hearing wild stuff, you know, she can escalate quickly helps you to be level headed and be like, Man, gratitude. Like, I live. That’s one of the things that I live by in my life, like gratitude, gratitude for where I’m at in life, that things that I have shelter, food, friends, family, like if you walk through life with that kind of mindset and perspective, like, I’m grateful for where I am, like, really, and then everything else that you get beyond that is a bonus. Yeah, so it’s just like, I’m not getting you mad at me. Like, I don’t know if you heard that Drake song was an intro at the beginning of one of Drake songs where somebody’s saying, right, like at the beginning of sonder saying, you man, you big man. Oh, you

look at you, you I don’t want to argue with you. Like you talking about but..

Kirk Ross 1:08:52
that mentality is cool.

Montay Lee 1:08:54
Like, yeah, I don’t got time to be arguing with you. You know, yeah. What’s in my life? And I’m grateful for the things that I have. Yeah. And I think that’s a good mentality to have just moving forward through life.

Kirk Ross 1:09:05
Dude, I think I mean, people watching listening, the more like Montay. I mean, I appreciate you coming on. And I appreciate your disposition. Dude, you’ve always been a cool guy that I’ve I’ve been looking forward to having you sit down. I’m glad you’re I’m glad you’re starting your own. You know, even doing your own creative stuff. But I’m also glad that you’re adding the podcast here to your repertoire. I really appreciate the journey part of or the journaling part of it. You’re kind of journaling. Yeah, that’s what I’m doing too, you know, on my Tuesday one, so I never really was able to

I’ve never really been asked about it, I suppose. But like I concur with a lot of the reasons that you’re doing it too. I’m surprised nobody asked you. Well, I have a I have an interview coming up for the show or one of my early guests is gonna interview me. Oh, that’s on my show. So like, I’m sure that stuff will come up on that. That’s gonna feel awkward, because that’s always on this in. Definitely. Like I could tell you like you like how I talked about from starting to finish

Montay Lee 1:10:00
You feel way more comfortable interviewing?

Kirk Ross 1:10:02
Oh my God now and like you ask great question my interviewing you know what the big I appreciate that but the biggest thing is I do a lot more nonverbal. This that’s a skill that you’ll pick up too. But this kind of stuff. Uh huh. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it helps. It sucks, though. It’s good for you. It’s good for the person talking because I’m giving you feedback that I’m listening. But when you’re trying to edit and you got you’re trying to cut yourself, oh, oh, no, you’re trying to so now I just give you more like, Yeah, but I need them like a comedian. Oh, yeah, you need that everyone needs I think active listening is a huge thing. You’re good at it. I think that’s, I think, ultimately, you’re gonna have a successful interviewing show if you want. Because I think you’re gonna be able to get people comfortable with you. And you talk all day with your defendants. Right?

Montay Lee 1:10:44
I mean, so you know how to like get through. I see people that are kind of, perhaps not really wanting to open up to you. Sometimes you get people who talk too much. Of course, I’m a master of cutting people are put off. Oh, where are we going? Don’t incriminate yourself. All right. Um, we’re like, Hey, where are we going? Okay, I’m asking about this. Alright, alright. I want to know where you live in here? Cool.

Kirk Ross 1:11:05
But Won’t somebody tell you the whole life story?

Montay Lee 1:11:07
Just like..I’m a master cuz I’m just like, okay. Alright, we’re gonna hear it. I tried to in a respectful way. Yeah, but you got to be the master of cutting people off.

Kirk Ross 1:11:15
Oh, Jessica, my wife’s like that with some of her clients. Like they’ll, they? It’s a her they’re your counselor to these people. She’s a counselor to these people. And they start talking about everything and she constantly has to snap them back. I just asked about your address. You’re paying me I don’t really know like everything else and like what you have for breakfast? It’ll go there. Yeah, I’m just like, I agree. I agree that windmills are the best way to sustain future power but that has nothing to do with your case. Can we get back on it? Yeah, let’s get to let’s get to the business. Okay. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, dude, I appreciate you coming on man. Do you have anything else you want to say I something’s something I’ll leave you with?

Montay Lee 1:11:48
You are responsible for everything that you have going on in your life. Don’t be a victim, Be a Victor and all the things that you can control. I feel like far too often in these day in times people are looking left right up and down on while they’re why they are in a particular situation. Have a victim mentality rather than a victim mentality. And I feel like you will go far because at the end of the day, you’re in control of your life.

Kirk Ross 1:12:22
Amen. Thanks for coming on. Thank you for having me brother. Finn. Great Oh yeah, dude, that was awesome. That’s a good way to enter to man Hell yeah. That’s it.

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